Syntax control code

[Robert Goldman]

I just pushed an edit of syntax-control.md in which I try to capture the
terminology.

Status: several Allegro failures break for me on test-syntax-control.
Results from Linux:

build/results/allegro8_64-test.text
build/results/allegro8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64_s-test.text

These failures seem to be due to NAMED-READTABLES not working properly
on these platforms, rather than on anything ASDF itself does.

Concern: As I was reading over syntax-control.md, it was brought home
to me that the ASDF shared syntax is initialized to the *initial syntax*
on the host implementation, rather than the standard syntax of ANSI CL.
My understanding is that this is done for backwards-compatibility with
some QL systems that assume they have access to extended syntax from
some implementation(s). I'm concerned that this will create a
maintenance headache going forward just so someone *else* can avoid
making some minor clean-up. Should we just suck it up and make the
shared syntax start out with the initial syntax? Why not break it now,
and save ourselves trouble later? Also, it seems like "initial syntax"
is not well-defined, even on a single implementation, since ASDF might
be loaded at arbitrary times, possibly after modifications to the
"initial initial" readtable. Finally, going forward, people will be
yelling at *us* if implementations change their initial syntax.

Unless there's a really important reason to keep this, I think we should
kill it.

[73budden .]

Hi! Where the document is found?

Post by Robert Goldman
I just pushed an edit of syntax-control.md in which I try to capture the
terminology.
Status: several Allegro failures break for me on test-syntax-control.
build/results/allegro8_64-test.text
build/results/allegro8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64_s-test.text
These failures seem to be due to NAMED-READTABLES not working properly
on these platforms, rather than on anything ASDF itself does.
Concern: As I was reading over syntax-control.md, it was brought home
to me that the ASDF shared syntax is initialized to the *initial syntax*
on the host implementation, rather than the standard syntax of ANSI CL.
My understanding is that this is done for backwards-compatibility with
some QL systems that assume they have access to extended syntax from
some implementation(s). I'm concerned that this will create a
maintenance headache going forward just so someone *else* can avoid
making some minor clean-up. Should we just suck it up and make the
shared syntax start out with the initial syntax? Why not break it now,
and save ourselves trouble later? Also, it seems like "initial syntax"
is not well-defined, even on a single implementation, since ASDF might
be loaded at arbitrary times, possibly after modifications to the
"initial initial" readtable. Finally, going forward, people will be
yelling at *us* if implementations change their initial syntax.
Unless there's a really important reason to keep this, I think we should
kill it.

[Faré]

It's in doc/syntax-control.md in the syntax-control branch (MR !86 on gitlab).
Unhappily, gitlab.common-lisp.net seems to be down right now:
https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/asdf/asdf
If symptom persists, you may have to use my github backup in the meantime.
https://github.com/fare/asdf/blob/syntax-control/doc/syntax-control.md

—♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics• http://fare.tunes.org
From a programmer's point of view, the user is a peripheral that types
when you issue a read request. — P. Williams

Post by 73budden .
Hi! Where the document is found?

Post by Robert Goldman
I just pushed an edit of syntax-control.md in which I try to capture the
terminology.
Status: several Allegro failures break for me on test-syntax-control.
build/results/allegro8_64-test.text
build/results/allegro8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64_s-test.text
These failures seem to be due to NAMED-READTABLES not working properly
on these platforms, rather than on anything ASDF itself does.
Concern: As I was reading over syntax-control.md, it was brought home
to me that the ASDF shared syntax is initialized to the *initial syntax*
on the host implementation, rather than the standard syntax of ANSI CL.
My understanding is that this is done for backwards-compatibility with
some QL systems that assume they have access to extended syntax from
some implementation(s). I'm concerned that this will create a
maintenance headache going forward just so someone *else* can avoid
making some minor clean-up. Should we just suck it up and make the
shared syntax start out with the initial syntax? Why not break it now,
and save ourselves trouble later? Also, it seems like "initial syntax"
is not well-defined, even on a single implementation, since ASDF might
be loaded at arbitrary times, possibly after modifications to the
"initial initial" readtable. Finally, going forward, people will be
yelling at *us* if implementations change their initial syntax.
Unless there's a really important reason to keep this, I think we should
kill it.

[Erik Huelsmann]

gitlab is back up now.

Regards,

Erik.

Post by Faré
It's in doc/syntax-control.md in the syntax-control branch (MR !86 on gitlab).
https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/asdf/asdf
If symptom persists, you may have to use my github backup in the meantime.
https://github.com/fare/asdf/blob/syntax-control/doc/syntax-control.md
—♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics•
http://fare.tunes.org
From a programmer's point of view, the user is a peripheral that types
when you issue a read request. — P. Williams

Post by 73budden .
Hi! Where the document is found?

Post by Robert Goldman
I just pushed an edit of syntax-control.md in which I try to capture

the

Post by 73budden .

Post by Robert Goldman
terminology.
Status: several Allegro failures break for me on test-syntax-control.
build/results/allegro8_64-test.text
build/results/allegro8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern8_64_s-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64-test.text
build/results/allegromodern_64_s-test.text
These failures seem to be due to NAMED-READTABLES not working properly
on these platforms, rather than on anything ASDF itself does.
Concern: As I was reading over syntax-control.md, it was brought home
to me that the ASDF shared syntax is initialized to the *initial syntax*
on the host implementation, rather than the standard syntax of ANSI CL.
My understanding is that this is done for backwards-compatibility with
some QL systems that assume they have access to extended syntax from
some implementation(s). I'm concerned that this will create a
maintenance headache going forward just so someone *else* can avoid
making some minor clean-up. Should we just suck it up and make the
shared syntax start out with the initial syntax? Why not break it now,
and save ourselves trouble later? Also, it seems like "initial syntax"
is not well-defined, even on a single implementation, since ASDF might
be loaded at arbitrary times, possibly after modifications to the
"initial initial" readtable. Finally, going forward, people will be
yelling at *us* if implementations change their initial syntax.
Unless there's a really important reason to keep this, I think we should
kill it.

[Faré]

Post by Erik Huelsmann
gitlab is back up now.

Thanks a lot, Erik! Congrats for drive-by bugfixing!

So the official URLs are:
Syntax control merge request:
https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/asdf/asdf/merge_requests/86
Current version of the document in the syntax-control branch:
https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/asdf/asdf/blob/syntax-control/doc/syntax-control.md
Final location of the document, once the branch is merged:
https://gitlab.common-lisp.net/asdf/asdf/blob/master/doc/syntax-control.md

—♯ƒ • François-René ÐVB Rideau •Reflection&Cybernethics• http://fare.tunes.org
Microphones, liberating singers from having to be loud to be heard, gave back
to each language a music that matches its own prosody.